Fishing Rod Sensitivity

[FlatsNBay]

Can the average angler tell the difference between rod sensitivity between different well-made rods?

Let me explain my thought process. I have and use a large selection of rods from very well-made manufacturers and range in price from $100 to $500. All have very excellent sensitivity, so much that it would be extremely difficult (for me) to say that the $500 is so much more sensitive than any one of my $100 rods.

As an example, I recently participated in a media trip for a company that was debuting 4 different models of rods at different price points ($100, $150, $299, $450). We had 4 professional anglers along with 4 members of the media and fished with over a hundred different rods in various actions in the 4 different price points. For 2 days, we were constantly picking up, swapping out, and fishing with different rod models in different actions, and we caught a ton of fish.  Much to all of our surprise, the $100 rod felt no different in sensitivity than the most expensive model.

That got me thinking, can you really tell the difference in sensitivity as long as you are buying a rod from a good company with an excellent reputation for craftsmanship?

[skidemn]

With all factors in the test being equal, then yes. I had never done a direct comparison with the same baits using the same techniques until I fished a recent night tournament. When you can't see your line, your bait or even where you are, your brain amplifies the senses you have left, which in my case made the sound of everything that much louder (also due to the relative silence of being on a closed lake at night), and the sensations I felt through my rods that much more noticeable.

I was getting bit well fishing a shaky head on my Dobyn's DX742SF ($340) with 7lb leader, but I was breaking off every fish because I couldn't get them out of the quagga muscle covered trees. Rather than take the time to retie a heavier leader, I picked up a Dobyn's SAM723SF ($180) which is 2" shorter, 1 power heavier and had 10lb leader already. I'm any case, I rigged up another shaky head rig, but I suddenly couldn't feel the bottom as well, and sometimes not at all. With the DX I can feel rock, sand, mud, moss, grass, and the texture of wood when it falls from one branch to the next, but the SAM (Kaden series blank) was not even close. I could feel resistance from weeds and impact with hard objects, but not the subtle things that help me know what's down there. It was much harder to stay in contact with the bottom, where I needed to be to get bit. I normally would have switched to my KD712SF and probably would have faired a tiny bit better due to the lighter tip, but the difference in sensitivity was unbelievable.


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[J.W.]

I guess it would depend on exactly which brands and models you were comparing, but I'm sure there's bound to be some brands where there's diminishing returns as you spend more money.

[loomisguy]

My first thought was that companies with a reputation for excellent craftmanship are dwindling down.
I'm fortunate to be able to fish a bunch of rods and to me the NRX has always been at the top of my list but they have gone up in price and I think the list is around $ 650 now. Thats a load.
I also have a bunch of Falcon Cara's and fishing side by with the NRX I can tell the difference but it's not night and day. Does that difference translate into more fish?  Honestly, I kinda doubt it.

[FlatsNBay]

Great comments. That was an interesting take on it Skideman with a night fishing comparison.

[Capt. BassinLou]

Flat's what fishing line were on all these test rods?

[Smallie_Stalker]

A couple of quick thoughts....

1) Yes, I do think you can tell the difference depending on certain factors

2) The best test would be a blindfold test where you don't get to see or know anything about the rods ahead of time and you are not told which rod you're given at any single time. Give the person the same rod 2 or 3 times (maybe in a row) and see if they say anything is better or worse

3) Flats, all the rods you tested that day were all from the same company. So what were the features the company was claiming justified charging more for a different model?

I think a better test is to take rods from different companies and test them side by side. Does company A's $100 rod feel more sensitive than company B's $100 dollar rod?  Why? What is the difference in materials, ratings and production process for each rod?

Years ago, when I got my first Dobyns, a Fury 733C which was retailing at $99.99 at the time. I was using all Abu rods at the time. I did a head to head "shootout" with the $99.99 Veritas, the $179.99 Veracity and the $199.99 Villain.

In terms of both sensitivity and balance the Fury absolutely blew the equally priced Veritas out of the water. It matched the $180 Veracity in sensitivity and exceed it in balance. It didn't have the sensitivity of the $200 Villain but was still better balanced.

4) There are so many different things that go into how a rod blank is built that can affect sensitivity. A finished rod's balance also affects sensitivity as well as other factors.

5) How much a company charges doesn't necessarily have anything to do with point #4.

I totally agree with skidemn. And I know for certain that my Xtasy rods are far and away more sensitive than my Champs, Abu, or Daiwa rods, especially when it comes to bottom contact.

I can tell you what kind of grass I'm fishing with that rod and I can detect the lightest bites with it that I am sure I would miss on other rods. I can even feel when a fish opens it's mouth and starts to suck the bait in making it easier to time my hook sets.

All of that translates into more fish caught if I don't make an angling error on my part.

Yes the Extremes and Xtasys I fish are expensive but they are much more sensitive than any of my other rods and better balanced than most. 

Can I still catch fish on a $100 rod vs. A $500 rod? Sure. Will I miss more detecting more bites on the same $100 rod? Personally I believe so.

And since I don't get many opportunities to fish anymore I need to maximize my potential for feeling what's down there so I can change presentations as needed, and feeling as many bites as I can when I get one.

When we find rods that can do that they're totally worth the price difference IMHO.



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[FlatsNBay]

Flat's what fishing line were on all these test rods?

The rods were all lined with the exact same line across the board for each of the different types of rods. As an example, all medium light spinning combos were spooled with the same 10 lb. braid with the same 8 lb. fluorocarbon leader. All crankbait rods were spooled with the same fluorocarbon, etc.

[FlatsNBay]

[/quote]

3) Flats, all the rods you tested that day were all from the same company. So what were the features the company was claiming justified charging more for a different model?

Smallie, I don't remember. I am seeing the same thing in the various rods that I do own from a different manufacturer.

[Hobious]

all else equal.  same line, poundage, reel?

[skidemn]

Great comments. That was an interesting take on it Skideman with a night fishing comparison.

Thanks! When I first started fishing the DX (in daytime), I was setting the hook on every rock, twig and stiff weed, because I could feel so much more than ever before. I was mainly fishing some Phenix rods and the Fury FR702SF and FR661SF, and never knew how much I was missing. I would often hook bass deep when dropshotting, because I would miss very subtle bites. Of course I'd feel them turn and swim, but by then it was in the crushers. After I got used to the increased sensitivity, I was able to improve my presentation efficiency, as I no longer wasted additional casts into muck bottoms or areas that didn't meet my pattern, such as sand or gravel while on a chunk rock bite pattern.

However, I didn't realize just how much I relied on my eyesight when you don't feel bottom contact and fall back on watching the rod tip and line movement. It was a real learning experience, and made me appreciate the sensitivity of the DX series that much more. While I do expect this to be a point of diminishing returns, I'm still super excited after that night tournament to try out the DRX I have coming shortly.

By the way, I'm an old school split shot technique guy, and I grew up dragging grubs with the line over my fingertip. While I would sometimes resort to this when the bites where subtle and I was using my Furys, it is completely unnecessary with the DX.


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[skidemn]

Yes the Extremes and Xtasys I fish are expensive but they are much more sensitive than any of my other rods and better balanced than most. 

Can I still catch fish on a $100 rod vs. A $500 rod? Sure. Will I miss more detecting more bites on the same $100 rod? Personally I believe so.

And since I don't get many opportunities to fish anymore I need to maximize my potential for feeling what's down there so I can change presentations as needed, and feeling as many bites as I can when I get one.

When we find rods that can do that they're totally worth the price difference IMHO.

Well said! This is exactly the boat I'm in, and barring me spending 200 days a year on the water, this better gear fills in the expertise gaps and improves my experience for the time I have available to fish.


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[FlatsNBay]

I think as anglers gain a ton of experience we begin to gain super awareness while fishing, almost like a hyper awareness of everything going on around you and enhancing your senses during each cast.

As an example, have you ever fished with a novice angler and noticed a bite that they were having on their rod before they did while they held on to their rod?

I think once you get to that level of awareness, rod sensitivity is negligible.

[bigjim5589]

I think as anglers gain a ton of experience we begin to gain super awareness while fishing, almost like a hyper awareness of everything going on around you and enhancing your senses during each cast.

As an example, have you ever fished with a novice angler and noticed a bite that they were having on their rod before they did while they held on to their rod?

I think once you get to that level of awareness, rod sensitivity is negligible.

This is a good point! 

I read a lot of comments in fly fishing forums about fly rods, and inevitably, sensitivity gets mentioned. That of course can be about casting or fishing and feeling the fly. Some will make claims how the more expensive rods improve their experience, and these discussions often get quite technical. Some of those guys are really into all the specs & technical aspects of rods!  I read the discussions, but seldom comment because frankly I lack much experience with the rods that are often being mentioned & compared. My most expensive rods are fly rods, I have 2 customs that are now old technology, but at the time, were higher end and $300 rods. They were never the "best" on the market. Most, are $150 rods or less. They all perform the same as near as I can tell. Fly rods can get crazy expensive too.

All the baitcasting or spinning rods that I own were $100 or less when I bought them. Several are older Bass Pro Shops Extreme series and I've had them for many years. I use them the most. I certainly can see this idea of sensitivity being of interest at the time of purchase, but does anyone really give it much thought when out on the water, other than perhaps the first time you may use a rod?  My mind is always on the fishing, not the equipment unless I have an equipment problem.

Many of those fly guys mention specifics about rods, including details such as lengths and actions they prefer for specific applications and that's no different than other technique specific rods. I've yet however to be out fishing, and had a 8' rod in my hand for example, and thought, wow, I sure wish this rod was 8'6"!   It's simply not something that pops into my head when I'm fishing regardless of the tackle I'm using at the time. I make due with whatever I have & am using at the time and frankly have never given much thought to technique either when buying any rod, other than generally. I have some relatively "cheap" composite rods that I had bought with crankbaits in mind, and some rods labeled as spinnerbait rods, but beyond that, don't give technique a lot of thought when buying a rod. I then may use a rod for a specific application as I feel it will work well no matter how it's labelled.

That's the same as with any other rod I may have been using. I've never thought that the rod I was using, was not sensitive enough. IMO, it's always going to be the person using the rod as much as the design of the rod and I agree, the longer I use a rod, the better the feel with it I gain. What I "feel" with a rod, may not be the same as another person feels using the same rod.

To that end, because my perspective is only from using $100 rods, I can't say if a "better" rod would improve my fishing, particularly for the added cost. Although it's been many years now, I've cast some higher end fly rods and didn't feel at the time, the extra price justified my replacing what I already had with any of them. They were sure nice rods, but I didn't feel there was anything special about them when casting them, and that's the only criteria I could have had at that point. They were certainly beautifully crafted and had a higher price tag, and in some cases were physically lighter in weight, but to me, I didn't see those attributes justified the added cost. And, with a fly rod, frankly casting is about 90% of "feel" anyway IMO.

That's pretty much the same with other rods I have. When I've bought them, I couldn't say "this is a sensitive rod" just by having them in hand. That's not something I could ever determine until I had fished the rod, and then sensitivity is still subjective. I have picked up rods and thought them to be very light as far as actual weight, but I don't know that necessarily relates to sensitivity when fishing. Perhaps it does for some of you folks. That physical weight is also something the fly guys talk about a lot, but has never been any concern for me. I've had many folks tell me, "that rod will wear you out"!  If that was ever a concern for me, I would have quite fishing a long time ago. 

So, for me, the same applies with any rod, as it has with my purchases of a fly rod. I can't really relate to a rod being sensitive, as they're all sensitive to some degree as I use them. I also tend to keep equipment as long as it works, and maybe getting used to any tackle helps with this idea of sensitivity. I have some solid fiberglass rods, and they sure are heavy, and probably not appreciably sensitive, but I'll still fish with them.

I can feel a difference in some rods I have when using braid compared to other lines, but beyond that, I don't give it much thought at all.

Maybe I'm missing something, by not having a "better" rod, but for now, I can't justify that kind of a purchase, just to say I have a more sensitive rod. If I fished as much as some of you guys, then maybe that might be different.     

[J.W.]

I know the original question was about sensitivity differences between price points within a specific brand, but for what it's worth, I can definitely tell a difference in sensitivity across the different brands I have on hand.