Braid line gets warped

[kiteman]

I am fairly new to all this so I'm most definitely doing something wrong and need help with diagnosing it.  I have a Pflueger President spinning reel.  Two questions:

1. I first tried to put cheap 6lb mono as backing, tied a double uni and added 15lb spiderwire braid, but I found that if I lost any line eventually my braid was getting stuck during casting on the slightly exposed uni knot that joined the mono and braid together.  Has anyone ever experienced that?

2. I also have noticed that even if I set my braid in water while spooling it new out of the box, it goes on smoothly, but after a while if I lose some line I see that all of the line on the spool that wasn't regularly casted appears warped.  Hard to explain but it zig zags around the spool and itself instead of going on in a very linear fashion.  I noticed when I start to cast this warped braid it is not easy to cast and often times it catches on itself within the spool, which severely limits the casting ability.  I find most of the time when this happens I am just pulling a bunch of line out with my hand and then reeling it in so it sets more linear.  Is this normal?

I've considered just switching over to 12lb berkley mono altogether, but don't know if that's going to be any better.

[Ron Fogelson]

Spincast reel, open face spinning reel or baitcaster?

[Pferox]

First off, welcome to Ultimate Bass.

Second thing is we need to know what kind of reel and the size it is to help give better input.

And I see Ron beat me to it. lol

[kiteman]

Sorry!  It's a spinning reel, a Pflueger President.

[Ron Fogelson]

I don't like spiderwire, never have tried it on and off over the years and well as I said 

15lbs braid is small, the line diameter and the non-very limited stretch aspects of braid cause the line to dig in on itself and bind up.  To limit this, I spool on all my line and then attach the hook/bait to something like my truck/mailbox and walk out my line.  Then hold the rod so the line is under tension and reel it back on.  Now from time to time I need to redo this, based on over runs or messed up casts some times within the same day sometimes once a week or so.

[LgMouthGambler]

Braid that is deeper down in the spool will become depressed and look that way. The line getting stuck during casting is most likely the result of the line digging in on itself due to the thin diameter. Welcome to the world of braid. Its kind of normal with thin diameter. Try and use a 30-40# braid.

[Ron Fogelson]

Sorry!  It's a spinning reel, a Pflueger President.

Spinning reels don't often wind a nice level wind pattern and IMHO even less so with small diameter braid.  The design of the bail, size of the spool amount of drag caused reel slippage, size/type of line all impart different reactions on the line wind pattern.

It will help to load your spool like I posted below and to redo it as often as needed to keep your line nice and tight on the spool,,, you can use your fingers while fishing to keep it snug when reeling in a bunch of loose line from picking out a birds nest.

[kiteman]

Thanks a lot for the answers.  Sounds like the line getting warped/depressed is normal and I should look at a much thicker line.  Would the 12lb mono not have this problem?  Biggest fish I've caught was 4lbs, and even though where I fish may have bigger fish, I'm not sure I need a 30lb line.

Also, has anyone experienced catching your line on the double uni knot when you add a backer like I mentioned?  It sounds like that may also be a product of having a thin braid line.

[LgMouthGambler]

Thanks a lot for the answers.  Sounds like the line getting warped/depressed is normal and I should look at a much thicker line.  Would the 12lb mono not have this problem?  Biggest fish I've caught was 4lbs, and even though where I fish may have bigger fish, I'm not sure I need a 30lb line.

Also, has anyone experienced catching your line on the double uni knot when you add a backer like I mentioned?  It sounds like that may also be a product of having a thin braid line.

With braid, its not so much the lb rating as it is the no stretch advantage. You will want a good size diameter for abrasion resistance.

[Pferox]

Braids were originally meant for spinning gear, the cross hatched pattern seen on the spool is a good thing, as long as it is TIGHT (RON tight).  Most of the better braid friendly reels don't lay the line down on the side of each previous wrap, instead it kind of like weaves it over, similar to the way a ball of string is made and wrapped.

If you are hanging up on your unknot on a cast, then have too much backing and not enough braid on the reel.  To help with that, you can go to another knot, like a blood knot, Albright special, Alberto, and some others.

With braid, you have to be line conscious more, when you cast, you want to slow the line down coming off of the spool when the bait is just about to hit the water, this will keep the line taught and eliminate a lot of the loose wraps problems.

[Pferox]

Chris Myers is quite an informative person, although he is a saltwater fisherman, much of the line management and reel care videos he has done are good to for everybody to watch.

This one is my favorite, I have learned a lot about casting lures with a spinning rod and braid.

[merc1997]

if your junction knot is exposed through the braid, you simply need to not have as much backing and put on more braid.  that is the only way to cover the diameter of the splice knot.  same rules apply for any type of reel you are using.

bo

[Oldfart9999]

Good video Jim! Good point Bo! I don't use any more than 20 lb braid and that is only on one outfit, mostly I use 12 or smaller and one set up has 6 lb test. Closing the bail by hand is very important, you can try lifting the rod tip to pull out slack at the end of the cast. I've grabbed the line when there's been a lot of slack. Reach down with one finger to contact the line as you are reeling in, it helps tighten the line. The big problem I have with wind knots is when I leave slack for the bait to sink straight down and the line wraps the tip, yes, braid will twist just not like flouro or mono. Also, using a product like KVD Line & Lure or BPS line conditioner regularly helps also. If you're having a problem with loose line cut of the bait and play out line as you idle the boat away, let 30 or 40yards then holding the line with a rag reel it back in, this will remove any twist and tighten the line back on the spool. Sounds like a lot to worry about but actually it's not and becomes second nature.
Rodney

[analfisherman]

Put a piece of electrical tape over the knot.
smooths it out plus you will see it and know it's time to put new braid on.

Myself, and I do use spinning gear often, I close bail by hand and seeing the line is right there I do a quick pull towards tip on line that tightens it.
Incidently I do this no matter what line I'm using.

My grandkids both use braid and spinning gear and I taught them from the start to do it.
And they rarely ever have a challenge.
Now it may sound cumbersome or an extra step but it becomes so second nature, you really don't even realize it.

Good advice anglers and great video Jim.

[BankBassBait]

Well i just started with braid and i put electric tape instead of mono, since i wanted to avoid the knot. Thicker line diameter seems to really solve the problem. My problems with braid have decreased greatly since i switched from 10# to 50# so hopefully that will be enough of a fix. I still get.my braid wrapped around my tio, but not as iften and it casts really well and has not dug into itself so far. Best of luck, tell us what you changdd and how it turns out.

[Bradleto]

As was already stated, watching Captain Chris Myers' video series on spinning tackle would be a great idea.

I just don't see your issue as being related to the braid size and 50 lbs. seems way too large to me except in rare circumstances.  Myers uses 10 most of the time and catches large tarpon and reds with it. You give away a huge advantage for spinning tackle, the ability to use light lines and cast far, the larger the line used.

The backing need not be more than 20 or so turns of the handle, if that. All it is doing is providing a slip-free anchoring to the reel arbor. Its other purpose is to use up some of the line capacity with cheaper line because braid is more expensive. So, say your reel's line holding capacity in 120 yards. No one can cast anywhere near that, and if your very longest casts are 50 yards, what you would want to do is make sure you have the 50 yards of braid and a nice fudge factor so that you never cast out your "backing to mainline" junction knot. You should never even see this junction knot. This will vary from person to person, but 40 yards of backing, then 70 yards of braid, then a little room for a leader . . . this would be about right for someone wanting to use cheap mono to save on braid costs.

If cost isn't as issue, 10 or so turns of the reel handle is more than enough mono backer for the non-slip anchoring effect, then top it off with braid, then a leader if it is called for.  You'll want those extra yards of braid for break-offs and re-ties one way or another. That way you can fish with the same braid for a long time.

As regards the braid as it is reeled on and how it lies, as it makes its piston like move while the bail is rotating and pulling line in, the line itself will be placed up and down the arbor to maintain a relatively flat spool. You shouldn't see anything like "X" crossings in the line.

If you get it right, you are going to love spinning tackle, love braid, too.

Brad   

[merc1997]

Well i just started with braid and i put electric tape instead of mono, since i wanted to avoid the knot. Thicker line diameter seems to really solve the problem. My problems with braid have decreased greatly since i switched from 10# to 50# so hopefully that will be enough of a fix. I still get.my braid wrapped around my tio, but not as iften and it casts really well and has not dug into itself so far. Best of luck, tell us what you changdd and how it turns out.

most of the time when you are wrapping the braid around your tip, it is from flipping the rod tip with slack, such as what is normally done when freeing a snagged lure with mono or floro.  braid, as with most anything, has its own rules to follow and you will not have any problems.  one rule in dealing with a snagged lure is to point your rod straight at the bait and gently pull.  if this does not free bait, get over the top of it and do the same thing and most often it will come right out.  you can not bow twang braid, or pop your rod as one would normally do with mono or floro.  most of my fishing buddies have all cussed braid until they learned how to use braid, and now none of them will use anything else.

hope this will help.

bo

[cojab]

One trick you can try to keep the knot joining your backing and braid from snagging is to cover it with fly tying head cement or superglue until it builds up and makes a smooth covering over the knot.
I agree you really just have too much backing on though.